Re: Question for controllers -- unable to contact ATC

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In article <97sssscm5oprqjl6b5jeo5gug5qd7hq8mf@4ax.com>,
Ron Rosenfeld <ronrosenfeld@spamcop.net> wrote:
>When I use a DP, I pick the one that applies to the airport from which I am
>departing, rather than, as you are suggesting, from some other airport.

I did not suggest taht you use a DP from some other airport. I don't
know how much clearer I can say it than that. When I say "use the DP"
and you ask "which one", I assume you think there is more than one to
pick from. Had you said at the start "there isn't one", I wouldn't have
to wonder if you want to use some other airport's DP. If there are zero
options, only a silly person says "which of these options should I
use?"

>>I have no idea what the "airport in question" is.
>
>I assumed you were trying to formulate a helpful response to my initial
>question, in which I specified the airport from which I was departing.

And that info is long expired. The answer was a generic one that applies
to any airport. I'm sorry if you expected a specific answer that was
usable only at one airport in the world.

>You seem to want to discuss a different issue, having to do with DP's in
>general.

"If you cannot safely level off for 20 seconds to try contacting ATC
prior to using your expected clearaince, then you are in a more serious
situation than just wondering whether you should continue to climb."
That's what I was discussing. What does that have to do with DP's in
general?

>Certainly a worthwhile topic, but not really having to do with
>the question I raised.

You wanted to know if you should level off or climb. My answer was
telling you that if you were doing things properly, you would have
no reason not to level off and talk to ATC. You will know very quickly
whether you should climb -- either ATC will tell you or you use the
expected based on comm failure.

>>But if you have no DP, you read the next paragraph, which starts with
>>"otherwise...". "Otherwise" means, "in other cases", which would cover
>>the case of no published departure procedure.
>
>I think your method of communicating is difficult for me to follow.

I think it is common english. "Use the DP, otherwise..."

>>So then, the worry about levelling off for 20 seconds to try to contact
>>ATC is moot. There is no terrain clearance issue.
>
>As I said, I thought you were responding to my initial question, and not
>promoting a different agenda.

I'm not promoting anything. I'm telling you to think about the
situation in your question and realize that stopping your climb isn't
going to be a problem. If it will be, then you are in a different
problem than just whether to bypass talking to ATC and use the
'expected'.

>Perhaps you should start a new thread on DP's.

This one discussing this question is fine. Perhaps you should start
another if this one is not adequate.